This episode was so good that I'm playing it again! Jen & Joe dated, married, built a house and had kids, all in their 40's. They're here today to talk about exactly that. They're funny, sweet, and pretty darn adorable together. Oh, and there's a little story from me about finding the extraordinary in the ordinary. Full transcript at www.iamthisage.com
This episode was so good that I'm playing it again! Jen & Joe dated, married, built a house and had kids, all in their 40's. They're here today to talk about exactly that. They're funny, sweet, and pretty darn adorable together. Oh, and there's a little story from me about finding the extraordinary in the ordinary.
In this episode, we talk about:
- Getting serious about dating in your 40s.
- What it's like to have kids later in life.
- Food and wine in Chicago.
Get in touch with Molly below:
IG: @mollyatthisage
Full transcript at www.iamthisage.com
It is the middle of August and someone told me that this means we are approaching breakup season. So if you are over 40 and worried about a breakup, have just broken up, or are single and ready to mingle, I'm here to tell you that it is never too late to find love. That navigating relationships continues until the end of life, the excitement of a new lover.
Never ends dating remains the same no matter our age, so get out there. Welcome to I Am This Age Proof It's never too late to make a big change. I'm Molly Cider, a midlife change coach, speaker, and the creator and host of this podcast. Today's episode is honestly one of my favorites.
It's a republish from a while back with the cutest couple, Joe and Jen, where they tell us all about how they met and started a family in their forties. And if you're like, that's great, but I'm in my sixties and I'd like proof from someone older than me, then I suggest you head back to episode 27 where Janet Helland tells her story about getting married at 80.
This episode is a little bit of a different format from what I do now, so you are going to hear a short and sweet story from me first, and then we'll get on with it. This episode is funny. They're funny, so listen up and enjoy.
When I was in college and nearing graduation, my friend pulled me aside and she said, Molly, I think you are going to do something cool and different with your life, and I can't wait to see what that is. To this day, it was one of the best compliments and biggest confines of my entire life. What would that be?
How will I know when I get there? What if I never do? It became a driver for my unconventional lifestyle. My motivation for seeking the extraordinary because I didn't want to let my friend down, but more importantly because she believed that I would find it. The problem, of course, is that I don't know what her definition of extraordinary or cool or different even is.
So here I've been all these years post-graduation trying to stand out, striving for the grandiose. So I might feel special, but what have I bypassed along the way? What if cool and different just means that every day I get to wave and say good morning to my neighbors. What if the extraordinary is in the journey?
Would it then matter if I ever arrived? If you are enjoying these episodes, might I ask you to send the show to one person you think might also enjoy it?
Thanks. It would really help. And now please enjoy Joe and Jen Campania. There we go. I got it. It was in Zoom. Okay. Okay, great. Can you guys hear me okay? Yeah. Mm-hmm. Okay. I'm good. Jen's like, uh, this is amazing. That's her usual face with me. Are you ready? Are you done? I'm so tired. So good that you're the one having issues and I'm the one just sitting here nicely waiting.
Oh, that's okay. The TV will break at some point. Just 'cause you looked at it too. It will. It'll,
I'm Jen Campania. I am 47 years old, despite my daughter telling me I was 70 this morning. Um, I am 47 and delightfully married to Joe, who will introduce himself. Hi, I'm Joe Campana. I am married to Jennifer Campana and yeah, my daughters think I'm older than my father, so that grandpa is younger than me.
'cause my children are gonna troll me from the age of four until I'm done. That's how it's gonna be. How old are you, Joe? I am 40. I had to think about that for a second. Thanks, y'all. Thanks for doing that. Worst intro ever. Welcome. Welcome to the pod. Yeah. Um, all right, so we're gonna get into it. Um, first of all, Jen, where are you from?
I'm from Michigan originally. I grew up in Kalamazoo, Michigan. Ah. Um, and I moved to Chicago full-time in 2008. Got it. And Joe, I know you're from Chicago, from the suburbs. Yeah, I grew up in uh, the Park Ridge area. I don't like to be one of those people who says they're from Chicago. And then you ask them where do they live?
And then they say the suburbs. 'cause it's not the same. Oh man. I'm one of those people. How old were you both when you met each other? I was four. You were 39. 39? Yeah. Okay. Were either of you ever married before? Yes, you were. I was, yes. And when and how? Like for how long and how old were you? I was mid twenties.
I was married for six years. Oh wow. Yeah. Okay. Joe, first, first marriage. First time for me. Jen. What? After you were So wait. You were divorced for your first time, obviously. Just first one. Yes. So far, so far, no, only one. Don't me, Molly. Geez. He's still the best husband. Not the tallest, but the best. I'm the best.
What kind of, what was it like dating for you afterwards and what, what kind of a dater were you? I was a very reluctant dater, I would say. Um, I spent a long time just not dating and just wanting to enjoy myself. I mean, so I as backstory, I, I married the guy I was dating in high school, so I never had that, like college dating and like crazy dating life.
So, And honestly, I, I had been with someone for so long that I just wanted time for me. So I didn't date a lot. I traveled a lot and tried to really connect with a good group of girls, um, and develop this really good network. Um, and I would date occasionally. I was more, I, I would definitely say I was a reluctant dater.
And what would make you want to date or go on a date then? I. Um, I mean, I like the idea of dating. I just didn't wanna waste a lot of time with a bunch of schmucks, and so that was my challenge. So I'd do the online thing for a while. I'd do a couple months. I'm like, I'm out. I can't, I'm done with this. I'm, I'm just gonna go find a fabulous trip to go on and go enjoy myself.
I mean, I wanted that companionship again. I wanted to find a relationship again, but I, I didn't wanna, Go through all of the hoops to, to, to just force the issue. Like I really wanted it to be much more organic. Did you think that you would wanna be married again? Yeah. I, I was not opposed to the idea of getting married again.
I definitely, you know, if I found the right person, you know, a family would've been great if I didn't. That was okay. I was kind of, oh, I had kind of come to some peace, um, with either way my life was going, but you know, I, I think the idea of having a family was always something that kind of was in the back of my head.
Um, so that was something that wasn't, you know, that I wanted to find someone to build a family with. Not just, I just don't wanna get married and get married. I like, I wanna find that person to create something with. Right. And build something bigger. Yeah. Did you ever feel pressure to have a family. No, no, I mean, so my sister had four kids.
She kind of took that off the table, and honestly, when I was younger, I didn't want kids. I was like, I don't know if I'm gonna have a family. I don't know where I'm at with that. It was in the back of my head, but at the same time, I'm like, if it doesn't happen, I'm okay with that. Like I have a pretty good life where I'm at.
Did you have a clear idea of what you wanted in a partner? So I went to pharmacy school and I had a mentor in the pharmacy school who was just a wonderful person, someone very special in my life, and he saw me go through my marriage and then get a divorce. And so, you know, we'd sit and have these like heart to heart talks and he's like, all right, what are you looking for?
We're like, what are your top three qualities you're looking for in a person? I'm like, I need a sense of humor. I need someone who's generous and I want someone who's adventurous. Willing to just pick up and go and, Hey, let's go somewhere and go do something fun. I'm really close on this. I'm really close.
You. You have all three. You three outta three have all. Which one are you generous? I Which one are you not? I dunno how generous. I don't know how generous I am. Lie it's like that bill. It's the Bill Murray moment and like, uh, Groundhog Day when she's like describing the perfect man, he's like, me, me again.
Me. I'm really close on this Joe. I was dating for you, like I was serious with one girl. Um, I moved in with her and then moved out. Like how quickly. Three months. That was, I mean, it was one of those, like my mother, she's like, well, I don't understand. And, and she had been divorced and I said, well, if we get de married, like you want me to, I will divorce her.
And she was, and that like stopped all the conversation again of like, well, maybe you should try or, I'm like, this isn't gonna work. Um, and there was just a lot of issues there. So for me, dating. Like I, I came to dating late in life, like I was a nerd. High school girls didn't know I existed college. I had fun for me, like my twenties in my, in my thirties.
I like, I, I was, I. I was still kind of surprised girls would date because it never happened when I was younger. And you know, I like to joke that, you know, some of my buddies, I'm like, you know, listen, I gotta be funny. Like I'm not six two, I don't have washboard abs. Like, I gotta know, like, how to work my way around a wine list and make a girl laugh.
Like I, I, I don't, I'm not working with a lot here. And, you know, I got a face for radio. It was, it was a running joke 'cause I had a group of friends get married at 27 and then another group get married like five years later. Um, and then it, I, I'm, I'm the last one. What do you think changed about you as a person in terms of dating?
Like from those days or from the, you know, the days where you didn't feel like anybody was interested in dating you to, like when you met Jen? I never really met anybody that I couldn't live without, and Jen and I actually broke up. I broke up with her. We were like six, seven months in. I. And I was like, you know, I feel like you're, she was like further down the path than me, and she was like, you mother, she was pissed and we broke up for a couple months and I was like, you know what?
I'm a dumb, dumb. Like, what? Wait, what did I do? Before you go, before you get into that, what was really the reason? Like, what were you doing? Yes, Joe. I, I just, I wasn't sure. I, I, I don't know. I think partly it was the whole, oh my God, this is getting serious. Like before it gets too serious. It's gonna be easier to break up now 'cause it gets really serious and then it doesn't work out, then I'm gonna be a bigger asshole.
Um, so it was partly that defense mechanism, but I, you know, had just never, like, I'd broken up, I'd broken up with many girls before and never really had any regret. I was like, eh, you know, and then, you know, but with Jet it was like, After a couple weeks, I was like, what did you do? Um, like, what is, what is going on?
Like what? And you know, I didn't, I think I may have gone on one date in between. I was like, this is. What are you doing? Um, and then I reached back out and I was like, Hey. And we went to dinner and she was like, listen, I'll give you another chance. She's like, you know, if we're gonna do this, it's like, you're serious and you think, and I was like, all right.
Enough. Um, Then, yeah. So here we are. I've never gotten back together with a person ever. Like once they're, once we break up, we're done. So why did he do that with Joe? Yeah, why? Why'd you, why'd you give a sweet, funny, generous, adventurous, Joe that second chance? I have to say, like our conversations, even when we were breaking up and kind of going on separate, we had a really good conversation about it and I felt like it was very, Adult and healthy, and I was like, you know what, I get it.
I get where he is coming from. This is just word of place. I'm bummed out about it. But he was so just. Open about it. I'm like, listen, I'm just at it. I'm just not quite there. And I'm like, all right. I get, you know, that's fair. I'm really sad about this and bummed. But then eventually, like a few weeks later, I'm like, Hey, I get a text.
I'm like, ah, what's going on now? I was like, all right, well we'll see. Um, And I remember him being like, Hey, do you still have my garage door opener? I think it's in your car. Oh, I was driving at the time. I'm like, oh yeah, it's right here. I'm like, yeah, I don't know. I'll check when I get home. I'll check in a while.
It was right next to me the whole time. I'm like, yeah, I'm gonna make him sweat a little bit and then have to work for this a little bit. Garage door opener. Classic, classic line. I don't even remember that. I don't even remember the excuse. I'm so interested in like people's, I guess, do you know anything about attachment styles?
This is not on the list of questions, by the way, but I'm just so curious. There's like different types of a attachment styles. So there's um, there's like anxious attached, secure attached, and avoidant attached and avoidant and anxious are basically like two sides of the same coin. But it all comes from just like insecurity and relationships.
And we either deal with it by becoming anxious and like, you know, reaching out constantly, like, hello, hello, are you still there? Or avoid it and we run away and disappear. Do, did you always. Had you done this before, Joe? Like, had you like sort of run away when things got serious before it happened with Jen?
Uh, I mean, if a girl started to get more serious than I was willing to ever be, then yeah, I'd be like, I'm not gonna, I. That's okay. Call, I'm not gonna, I'm not gonna see her around for drama. Um, but yeah, no, she was really, I mean, obviously my only marriage, she was the only one that was like that. But I think, I think the thing for me was, is that I liked her independence and, you know, that was something I was, that was a quality I was looking for.
Um, you know, where, you know, you date people and it's like you feel like you're the one holding them up or like, you know, I don't know what I, I, I, I don't know if it's holding up or it's like there, a large part of you is a part of them, and I think that's fine over time, but in the beginning it's like, whoa, this is like, you are gobbling up way too much.
And for, for me it was, I, I appreciated her independence. Like she didn't need me at all. Um, but the fact that, you know, she was letting me into her life was, you know, was nice. Yeah, that makes sense Joe. Did you ever feel like, um, like nervous or panicked at all about getting into a partnership or not having a, like a partnership?
Yet at your No. I mean, I think it's a little bit easier for a guy, but I got to a point where, you know, I was like, you know what, if I meet someone, great. If I don't, I live a great life. Um, you know, I would, I would've wanted someone there. Um, I'd always wanted children, so if that, you know, didn't happen, I was like, you know, maybe I just, you know, meet someone who has kids or I, I, I never discounted that, but no, I never, I.
I was never like, you know, panicked about it. Yeah. You know, I, I, I, for me it's like, you know, I, I traveled and had fun and had lots of friends and, you know, was always able to visit people and, and I had a, you know, a good life, so I, I wasn't like, you know, there wasn't anything like, it was like, oh, I'm really missing this.
I, I didn't have that part. Jen, did you ever feel like maybe you wouldn't meet anybody or it wasn't gonna happen for you in terms of, or again, I should say like a marriage again or a long-term relationship? Did that ever worry you? Yeah, I mean, so I was in a long-term re I was in a good relationship for just over two years before I met Joe.
Um. I was kind of like got outta that and I was like, God, if this is as good as it gets out there, then I'm probably not gonna get married again. I was like, yeah, I think maybe I just need to reconcile that. Maybe this just isn't gonna happen. If this is as good as it gets. Um, So, yeah, I mean, I definitely was like, eh, and I, and I have to say, I was, we, we met online and, you know, I, I was kind of nearing that point again of, oh God, I can't do this again.
And then Joe reached out and pinged me and I'm like, all right, I'll go on one last day before I just shut this down again. I can't, I need a break again. And he got in under the wire. He was the last one. I, I feel like, um, you know, I kind of asked you this already, Joe, but like I, I feel like obviously we start dating kind of when we're like kids, like your daughters are probably like, I'm gonna marry so and so, or whatever.
Oh, yeah. Um, like what, like Jen for you, I'm sure that. I guess, here's my question. How are you different in terms of like between your first marriage and your marriage with Joe? Like mm-hmm. Because I think that is a huge, that makes a huge difference. You know, we work on ourselves and we grow and we, yeah.
Figure out how to communicate better and all those things. Like what changed for you? Um, probably my sense of self-worth. And independence. Um, I think I grew into myself and realized that I have a voice and I need to, to share that voice, and I need to recognize me and that I bring something to the table and that, you know what, if I need something, I need to have that recognized.
And I think that that was a big, painful learning. Um, that just didn't happen in my first marriage. You know, I just kind of shrunk down and I didn't let my voice, I didn't insist that I was heard, right. And, and so I kind of got steamrolled a lot. I was like, I, I'm done being steamrolled. I, I wanna have an equal partner.
And that was critical for me. How did you learn to stand up for yourself? I. Um, I think at some point I finally had to, and realizing that, listen, this is not a life I wanna live. This is not what I'm doing. Like professionally, I was doing very well in my career. I was, you know, I. Making advances. I was doing things in my career, but personally I was realizing I was kind of taking some steps back and I realized, you know, like my family was noticing, other people were noticing.
I'm like, this is not, this is not the life I want. This is not where I want my life to be heading, and I certainly am not gonna have a family in this situation and completely lose myself. So it was just something that I finally kind of hit a breaking point and was like, I, I can't. I can't be here anymore.
Yeah. Do you remember what it was like when you first sort of started practicing standing up for yourself? Because I ha I, I have struggled with the same thing. It's hard. Yeah, it's hard. It's really hard. Yeah. It's probably one of the hardest things, and honestly, I've had to do it in my professional career as well, and that has been some of the hardest conversations I have ever had to do.
How do you get through or how do you navigate that? God, deep breathing. Honestly, like trying not to hyperventilate. I mean, I've had to have those like awkward sexual harassment conversations with people, several levels higher than me. And those are some of the hardest. I mean, you're terrified. This could affect my career.
This could affect everything. Um, but I've gotten to the point, and I think going through that first marriage and finally standing up for myself and realizing that I could come out from it better. I'm a better person for it, that I do have value and I can bring something to the table. Has kind of set me up for the difficult conversations I've had since then.
You know, I think Joe and I, when we broke up and had that difficult conversation, I was like, this is okay. Like this is, it sucks and I don't wanna lose him, but at the same time, I'm gonna be okay. So I think some of those early really terrible conversations and situations have allowed me to. Just kind of brace me for, for all these hard ones now.
Yeah. I think also like for me, like being a girl dad and having two girls, it's something that I am. More aware of, like, as a boy growing up, you're like, oh, whatever. Um, you know, especially like in the eighties, like, you know, it was kind of those old stereotypes and, and tropes of being a man, but with my girls, it's gonna be teaching them their independence.
Mm-hmm. And, and that that is a thing and it's perfectly okay. I think the world is a very different place in that, but I think there's also those old, old parts are still there that you have to deal with. So for me it's, you know, so that they have that ease of having that confidence, but also, you know, being able to have that conversation is gonna be very important and it's gonna be very different for the two of them.
'cause Lucy, it's gonna be, you need to be a little bit more nice and you know, she's a hard little girl and I appreciate that. Like she's, She's tough and Serena's a little bit softer and you know, she's gonna possibly get pushed around a little bit. Mm-hmm. You know, or she's gonna get pushed to her limit.
But that limit should be a lot shorter than what I think she would let go on. Um, you know, but it's gonna be interesting to see them, but it's gonna be teaching them that that independence and that strength is important and not kind of, you know, girls are this way. Mm-hmm. Like, you know, that doesn't make sense to me.
Yeah. It sounds like too, Jen, like you sort of grew into and learned your worth. Mm-hmm. So like it was easier to step into your worth and you were less afraid of losing, or I guess you maybe understood that you, you weren't losing anything. It didn't. Have anything to do with you and, and it didn't mean anything about your work.
Yeah, I mean, I think I've realized that, you know what, it's okay. I'll figure it out on the next go around, right? Like, if this doesn't work out, then fine. It's not meant to be. That's fine. I'll find something better. Right. And I mean, I, I honestly just had a conversation yesterday with a former colleague who I managed and, you know, I'm helping her work through an offer for her new job.
And I'm like, listen, you have to. Advocate for yourself, and this is how, you know, trying to mentor kind of these younger females in the work world of you have to know that it's okay to to advocate for yourself. Yeah. And that's both personally and professionally, right? You have to have that. You have to be able to do that.
Yeah. And also this is something that I'm always telling myself that like, it may not sound all that like pretty or clean, you know, it might sound, it might come out a little bit messy, but like as you do it and as you practice, yeah. Yeah. It'll come out a little bit better and a little bit easier and Yeah.
And that's okay. Yeah. Um, okay, so you met on a dating app. Mm-hmm. Which one? eHarmony Harmony. I believe neither of us is that Christian. So it's, it's weird. Oh, I forget that. That's a Christian. I didn't know that it was, I didn't think that it was, I just knew you had to invest time before you actually got to meet the person.
So much. That's how, that's how the Christians get you. Yeah, I guess. I didn't even realize that. Cue all the Christian bad media coming at Molly. Now write those letters. Molly Cider. Um, what did you do on your first date? Do you remember? We went for a beer. I. Where we did the monkey paw, the monkey. We did, I know the paw.
Yeah. Went for a beer in the afternoon. I got, we had, I think we had two beers, I think. I think Jen damned me the opportunity to have two beers. Mm-hmm. I think she was going into it like, I'll have one beer. Yep. I gotta walk to talk and closed. Five minutes. It's like two blocks from her house. I can like walk there, I'll get back by three.
I can walk the dog and then I think, and I get through the day. It'll be fine. It'll be, you know, whatever. It's not, Michigan's not playing today? Nope. Easy, easy commitment. Yeah. In and out. I offered to drive her home. She's like, you can just drop me, hit this corner right here. Um, I was like, all right. I never let any guy know where I live in the first few hits.
I'm like, no, you can just drop me here. I'm Where do you live? Just up, just up there. A little base. It's all good. Yeah. In a building, there's a roof. These are things that women need to think about. That are totally, we do worry about and that men like never even consider. Yeah. As a non predatory male, I understand that.
I also, you know, being a, a guy who is taught to, you know, make sure everybody's okay. It's also a little weird to be like, okay, are you gonna be, can you text me that you're home? Okay. After you walk three blocks through the snow? 'cause I'm not allowed to know where you live. I'm sorry. I gave off these murderous rapey vibes during our date, but, You never No.
Just text me. No, I, I honestly, I totally understand, but I would always say, please text me when you got home, so I know you're right. Yeah. That's nice, Joe. Okay. So you and I are both come from the, like wine and food industry. Mm-hmm. Um, you were a chef for a really long time. I was in the wine industry for a really long time.
Did you ever. Like, did you to think about where you would go for a drink? Oh, yeah. Or food. Totally. Like, yeah. I, I would never go places early on if I knew people because then it would be a thing. Right. Um, and I didn't, yeah, I, I, I didn't, I didn't need that early on. I was like, let's go decent places. And then once I knew people and like dated them enough, I would go to places.
I knew people because I knew it was gonna be a whole experience. Yeah. I'm the same. And I feel like I'm always. I always have to be the one to suggest, or like oftentimes someone will be like, oh, you're in the wine industry. There's this really cool place called Rootstock. Let's go there. And I'm like, it's literally like my home away from home or something.
You're like, yeah, I don't wanna do that. People are gonna know I'm on a date. Yeah, no, I would definitely try to pick spots. In the, in the early, in the early few dates that I didn't know people. Um, because when I would go on dates or when I, you know, take a date or I go to dinner and I know places people, you know, it's a completely different experience than normal and, you know, extra food starts coming and the chef comes, says hello and yeah.
Girls are like, who the fuck are you? Yeah. That's also an impressive thing. Oh, absolutely. There's a strategy to that too. There's Yeah, ab, yeah. I'm not dumb. Not pulling the ace outta the hole in the first hand, Joe, did you like Jen right away? Did you know? No. I mean, she was the one. No, I, I, I, I'm always amazed at those stories.
I met her across the room and I'm like, that's the woman I'm gonna marry. Okay, fine. That's a little, that's a little psycho to me. When did, that's like stalker fair. When did you realize that you really liked her? Or was it Not until six months later? Six months in a few weeks, six months in a breakup later, then I really, she was the one.
Thanks for selling me out, Molly. Ugh. Look, I don't know. I think, you know, I, I, I definitely liked her right away. Um, you know, I appreciated, you know, the, her sense of humor and putting up with my sense of humor. Um, going to her, the fact that she liked sports was a big thing for me. 'cause I'm a sports person more than a, a music or anything else.
Um, so I, I, I liked that, but I mean, I, I definitely liked her fairly, fairly quickly. Jen, are you a big food person? Like, do you like to eat? I do like to eat. Yes. I'm not like foodie like you guys, but I do. Yeah. I mean, I love going out and enjoying good food, good wine. Yeah. I mean, it's, which is funny because if you would've known me growing up, I, I don't think I had my first vegetable until I was like a senior in high school.
I. Oh, so I grew up in a ridiculous household that didn't eat food. Um, theres two salads. I don't know the difference between them. 'cause they look the same. They're not salads. It's, it's cool. They're not salads. It's cool. It's a cool whip in mayo. It's, it was an ambrosia, no ambrosia and then white salad.
I'm like, what's the difference? What is white salad? I don't know. There's a white salad and an apple salad and they all have a lot of whipped cream, a little bit of fruit. It's. It's terrible sugar. It's all sugar. It's all sugar. Yeah. But you know, I kind of hit like my senior year high school and I wanted, like, I was excited about trying new foods, so I enjoy trying foods.
Um, I'm still a little nervous about some things and I think that just comes from my, my background. But, um, I'm, I, you know, we do tasting menus and stuff and I love it. It's great. Do you cook too? I used to, I cook for my children every night. Every single night. Every night. Oh, every night I cook for my children.
What is happening right now? This, it's the, it's the same old married argument that's so aggressive. I work every night. I do it. I mean, it's amazing. Molly, she gets off her cross climbs, down cooks to make breakfast every morning, dinner, every night, breakfast. I mean, it's all, I mean it, it's one of those where she will complain about how hard it is, but she has done it to herself.
Jenna has done this to herself where you'll ask the children, Hey, what would you like for breakfast? And it's like they're at a restaurant. Well, I'd like strawberries and always with milk. I want a pancake in a specific shape. Uh, I'd like these kind of waffles versus those kind of waffles. Lucy chooses from four different kinds of eggs and it's just like, are you kidding me?
I'm a short order cook. Every point. Yeah. Done it to her. You, you could be like, dad, can we do it this way? Oh, we're out of those. Like, I will lie to them. Not without any guilt. We're out. Don't have it. Can't do it. And then I'll come home and I'll, if, and if we're cooking dinner or we're having a a meal, I'll be the one who gets home a little bit after her and the kids and, and I'll cook us dinner.
So Jen used to cook. I have ruined that for her, apparently. Oh, Jen, is Joe controlling in the kitchen?
No, I don't think controlling is the right word. I don't No, I agree. I don't think controlling is the right word. Okay. Right. He's very independent and he likes to have his space and he just, he, he's comfortable doing it. Like he's, he's a chef. He's done it on his own. He doesn't need your help. So I just walk away, stay out of his way.
I mean, there are people who are always like, what can I do to help Joe? And it's like, just leave him alone. Although when Jen and the kids bake, And they do it. I, I, I like, I'm the cleanup crew. Like, I try to not get in the way of how I do it. 'cause the girls will tell me, daddy, that you're doing the eggs wrong.
I'm like, I'm not, I'm not doing the eggs wrong. I bake, I bake with the kids. He is not, and they always tell if Daddy, that's not right, daddy, you're doing it wrong. It's amazing. Yeah. They have no concept of like, Where I've cooked or any of that. Like I'm just dad and I'm some schlub who's trying to like do what mommy does correctly, and I'm like, whatever.
Do you think that if you would've met in your twenties, that you would've liked each other as much? I. I hope so. I think so. I think yeah, we would've liked each. Yeah. I mean, I hope so. I hope so. Yeah. I, I don't, I I mean I think it's one of those where awkward question. Yeah. I think we liked each other. I think it's just a question of do you end up with each other?
That's the hard part. Yeah. Maybe that's a better question. Do you think you would've ended up with each other if you met in your twenties? I think, I think the, the interesting part about the twenties is it's people who get married in their twenties and stay married forever. I'm amazed by it 'cause one.
Like finding anybody is hard. Mm-hmm. But then to grow together and like put up with each other for that long and grow in the same direction Yes. Is impressive. Yeah. Um, because it's like when you're dating, there's so many things that have to like click into place like a, you know, a key going into a lock that's just difficult.
And the fact that one little thing can go wrong and derail it. For you might seem small, but the other person is big. And then you get into it where, you know, like Jen could have been coming off of a bad breakup and be like, Joe's great, but I'm just not in that place right now and I don't wanna get serious.
Even though he does and, and I think that's the part where I. You know, it's gotta be timing and mm-hmm. And everything else. It's uh, it's partly where you think about it and you're like, you're amazed anybody gets married and stays together. Like, you know, today, back in the fifties, they had no choice. You know, they met for a week.
They, one, one off to war. They, they held hands and kissed and they had to commit. So, you know, it was a different building from purpose. Right, right. Well, women only had one purpose then Molly. Molly, it was to get married. Yeah. And have how old was she gonna have a house? Right. Not gonna have a credit card, so, right, right.
So yeah, I, I, I, I think, yeah, I think we would've been friends and we would've gotten along, but I, who knows. Yeah. So you got married and you had kids, how much longer into your. Because Joe likes to say we've had an aggressive marriage. So we, he proposed in 2015. We got married in 2015. We had twins in 2016.
Bought a house in 2015. Yeah, we bought a house. We got engaged, bought a house, got married next year, had twins. Went through I V F, had twins. So that's a whole nother thing. And then, um, yeah, and then we bought his mom's house 2017. 2018 is when we bought it and yeah, we built a house together and moved in.
In 2019. You bought your mom's house and you moved in there? Yep. Tore down. Tore down. Rebuilt, okay. Yeah, after she passed away. Okay. I like to clear that up 'cause people think I put her in a home, bought her house for down. No, she was, and we told her we were gonna do it. She knew. Knew. She knew this was gonna happen.
She knew. She was excited. She was happy. Yeah. Not some slumlord throwing this mother out. What do you, what do you think the benefits are of having kids later in life? Financial stability. Yes. And patience for the most part. I think we just have a different threshold of patience and chaos. Being older, like, eh, you know, we don't, I don't feel like we sweat the little stuff quite as much.
Yeah. I mean, being older, we're not changing as humans as much anymore. Yeah. You know, our personalities are pretty locked in and that helps. And you've coped and you're not dealing with chaos. You know, this isn't the first time you're dealing with such chaos. Um, but at the same time, yeah, being able to throw money on a problem.
Is much easier, um, than if you're 27 and you's like, well, uh, I don't really have the money to pay for this, but it would make my child happy. Now. I'm like, whatever, I don't care. Plus, we've seen all of our friends RA and siblings, like, you know, my oldest niece is 21 years old now, you know, so I've seen our friends raise kids.
We've kind of seen what they've gone through. We know what's coming. We know what to expect. It doesn't necessarily make it easier, but this isn't, you know, completely. Uh, you know, blind ground that we're running through. Yeah, that makes sense. Learning from their experiences. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. I, I just, I recently interviewed somebody who, um, His father had him when he was like in his fifties and he was talking about how he didn't really know his dad until his dad was probably like in his late fifties.
'cause he, I think his dad was maybe like early fifties when he was born. Um, and his dad ended up, ended up living until he was. 99. Wow. Nice. And he was saying that. Yeah. And we talked a lot about that, but he was saying that he kind of thinks that probably having kids later in life actually allowed him to stay younger longer and live longer.
What do you think about that? I, I, I don't disagree. I mean, I think mentally you've gotta stay sharp. You're definitely dealing with things. You're dealing with more, you know, when you're, when you're, you've got 21 year olds at this point, or 20 year olds, you're kind of like, all right, well what am I gonna do?
Like at this point, I gotta like teach them things and think through. You're definitely more active, I think, mentally and physically than you would be if you had kids that were much older. Because at this point you're kind of like phoning it in as a parent probably, right? Like you're just trying to get 'em home by a certain time.
Or, you know, the math, new math is, is terrible. Type comments, but, um, but yeah, no, I would, I would agree with that. I think it does keep you younger. The problem is that you're dealing with younger parents, um, and you have to like, you know, befriend them, which is good and bad, but, Or you try and go ice skating and fall and crack your tailbone because you're trying to learn how to ice skate to keep up with your children and you do that.
Yeah. Any, any, any physical harm that happens now trying to keep up with your children is gonna be, you gotta have a longer life than LA if you're older. Yeah. How old were you when you originally got divorced? Uh, 29, 30. 30. I was 30. Okay. Now, if you could go back and give your 30 something self dating advice, what would it be?
I dunno if I would, I feel like I like the way I handled dating back then. Quite honestly. I like that I wasn't just like this crazy serial dater and felt like I needed to be out there and desperate to find someone. Like I'm really happy I spent the time to focus on me and to travel and to have these amazing world experiences.
I mean, it traveled all over the world and I think that I'm really thankful I had that chance. And I wanna eventually do that with the kids, you know, and, and give them that exposure. So I am, I don't know if I would change anything quite honestly. Cool. Good answer. Um, Joe, what about you? If you could go back and give your 20 something self dating advice, what would it be?
I'd just say be patient. You know, don't, there's no need to rush. Um, yeah. I don't know if I would change much either. I, I think it's that it's be patient and be, be true to your honest self. It is important, you know? Mm-hmm. I, I would always, you know, whenever I talk to, used to and, and then one or two of Jen's friends and a few of mine who are still single, I'm like, listen, you know what the answer is, and you, you know, you say it out loud, it's real.
So, you know, just be honest and, and you can, you know, bss yourself as long as you want, but the second that you say out loud that it's like, ah, I gotta break up, or They're bad for me, then you gotta do something about it. So, you know, just, just be honest and true to yourself and, and don't change or become somebody else for, for somebody for some reason, you know, that that doesn't, that's not gonna last.
Yeah. Joe and Jen, this was so fun to talk to you. It was, this was really, really fun. I really appreciate your time. Yeah, thanks Molly. This was great. Thank you. Uh, yeah, look forward to, to hearing it and seeing how we do.
Thank you to David Ben Ott for Sound Engineering. Dan Daven for my music and David Harper for my artwork. I am Molly Cider, your producer and host. This is I Am This Age. See you all next time.